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Post by Machski on Mar 16, 2020 16:35:54 GMT -5
Let me also clarify that I'm not ruling out Seven Bros being relocated to Merrill Hill upon its likely retirement next year. Both it and Tempest are pretty well built lifts (late Yan fixed grips had issues with the grips and aluminum sheave assemblies, both of which have been fixed by Poma). I also don't think they would replace the drive terminal on Tempest and nothing else, there's no logic to that. At most they could upgrade the tensioning system to use longer rams and therefore have more active tension travel (better wind performance that way), but there's nothing wrong with the drive terminal as it is that would warrant replacing it. This is the general alignment I would expect for the Merrill Hill lift: View AttachmentBoth Tempest and Seven Bros. could run on that alignment at design capacity without any sort of drive upgrade. Seven Brothers is a Garaventa C-TEC triple, not a Yan. The one issue moving Jordan to Tempest is that it spins clockwise, which would cut off even more of the top of Tempest trail by the unload terminal since the ramp would need to be wider into the trail than the current lift. If they stick with FG at Tempest, maybe they replace all the lift gear except for that fancy new carpet. If they intend to go HSQ there, it makes absolutely zero sense to ever put in a carpet for a FG first. If you didn't need that concrete vault foundation, then maybe. But if you are doing that and probably dealing with ledge (given the brook right near it, wouldn't doubt they will have to), that makes no sense to rip it out a few years later. The carpet has been thought of there for at least half a decade if not more, it is possible they just carried that thought forward and are unsure the direction they will finally go there.
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Post by Max on Mar 16, 2020 17:01:12 GMT -5
Seven Brothers is a Garaventa C-TEC triple, not a Yan. The one issue moving Jordan to Tempest is that it spins clockwise, which would cut off even more of the top of Tempest trail by the unload terminal since the ramp would need to be wider into the trail than the current lift. If they stick with FG at Tempest, maybe they replace all the lift gear except for that fancy new carpet. If they intend to go HSQ there, it makes absolutely zero sense to ever put in a carpet for a FG first. If you didn't need that concrete vault foundation, then maybe. But if you are doing that and probably dealing with ledge (given the brook right near it, wouldn't doubt they will have to), that makes no sense to rip it out a few years later. The carpet has been thought of there for at least half a decade if not more, it is possible they just carried that thought forward and are unsure the direction they will finally go there. Tempest is a Yan. I probably should have noted that I was still referring to that lift. Also Seven Bros was built in 1985, before the Garaventa CTEC merger (hence it's just CTEC) and uses some unique equipment that CTEC only used on a few lifts.
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Post by Machski on Mar 16, 2020 17:57:42 GMT -5
Seven Brothers is a Garaventa C-TEC triple, not a Yan. The one issue moving Jordan to Tempest is that it spins clockwise, which would cut off even more of the top of Tempest trail by the unload terminal since the ramp would need to be wider into the trail than the current lift. If they stick with FG at Tempest, maybe they replace all the lift gear except for that fancy new carpet. If they intend to go HSQ there, it makes absolutely zero sense to ever put in a carpet for a FG first. If you didn't need that concrete vault foundation, then maybe. But if you are doing that and probably dealing with ledge (given the brook right near it, wouldn't doubt they will have to), that makes no sense to rip it out a few years later. The carpet has been thought of there for at least half a decade if not more, it is possible they just carried that thought forward and are unsure the direction they will finally go there. Tempest is a Yan. I probably should have noted that I was still referring to that lift. Also Seven Bros was built in 1985, before the Garaventa CTEC merger (hence it's just CTEC) and uses some unique equipment that CTEC only used on a few lifts. That's right on 7 Bros being just a CTEC, but its sister lift wouldn't be far away at Shawnee if it moves (their summit triple is the old North Peak Triple from Loon of the same vintage).
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Post by Machski on Mar 23, 2020 12:55:27 GMT -5
Probably best barnstormer stays where it is. It was a club order and I don't think it was ordered as robustly powered for a full carrier compliment that most resorts would likely like anyway. You never know how a take down and reinstall will affect a lift long term.
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Post by junior on Mar 23, 2020 13:42:59 GMT -5
Killington's done this with numerous lifts and all attempts were hugely successful.
It's the brand new lift (SQ-6) that has become a headache....
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Post by Machski on Mar 23, 2020 15:32:06 GMT -5
Killington's done this with numerous lifts and all attempts were hugely successful.
It's the brand new lift (SQ-6) that has become a headache....
I do not believe they have tried to move and relocate a detachable lift however.
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Post by junior on Mar 23, 2020 15:44:43 GMT -5
Killington's done this with numerous lifts and all attempts were hugely successful.
It's the brand new lift (SQ-6) that has become a headache....
I do not believe they have tried to move and relocate a detachable lift however. None that I recall as far as detachables go. Good catch..
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Post by Max on Mar 31, 2020 21:40:28 GMT -5
I am assuming that like everything else, Doppelmayr's manufacturing facilities have been disrupted by COVID-19. It's also noteworthy that an awful lot of both Kanc 8 and the new Swift Current at Big Sky will be coming from Doppelmayr's Wolfut, Austria manufacturing facility rather than Salt Lake City or St. Jerome. I'm assuming that both projects are going to be way behind schedule (Loon/Boyne was expecting to break ground on Kanc 8 in April). I haven't heard of any work starting at Loon (not that it should given the current situation); that's going to be something to keep an eye on in the next few months. Using the payment schedule on page 15 of Barnstormer's quote (page 30 of the PDF), I think we can assume that Boyne has made at least 2 if not all 3 down payments (either totaling 10% or 25%), which I think could be upwards of $2M-$2.5M per lift. Both projects have to be on the rocks, but I haven't heard anything yet about cancellations.
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Post by Machski on Apr 1, 2020 8:57:04 GMT -5
I am assuming that like everything else, Doppelmayr's manufacturing facilities have been disrupted by COVID-19. It's also noteworthy that an awful lot of both Kanc 8 and the new Swift Current at Big Sky will be coming from Doppelmayr's Wolfut, Austria manufacturing facility rather than Salt Lake City or St. Jerome. I'm assuming that both projects are going to be way behind schedule (Loon/Boyne was expecting to break ground on Kanc 8 in April). I haven't heard of any work starting at Loon (not that it should given the current situation); that's going to be something to keep an eye on in the next few months. Using the payment schedule on page 15 of Barnstormer's quote (page 30 of the PDF), I think we can assume that Boyne has made at least 2 if not all 3 down payments (either totaling 10% or 25%), which I think could be upwards of $2M-$2.5M per lift. Both projects have to be on the rocks, but I haven't heard anything yet about cancellations. I would tend to think both of Boyne's projects lift-wise were financially covered when ordered and not dependant on future earnings to complete the purchases. I could be wrong on that. Obviously cash flow they might expect at this time of year has probably slowed to a trickle so that could be an issue if they have build target payments due. But assuming Dopp is also now behind schedule, that may delay when Boyne has to lay out more $$. I'm sure its a delicate, intricate dance.
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Post by Machski on Apr 1, 2020 9:57:56 GMT -5
BTW, changing of the guard at Dopp USA yesterday too.
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Post by Machski on Apr 1, 2020 16:23:50 GMT -5
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Post by Max on Apr 1, 2020 16:26:59 GMT -5
New installation are down to 24, less than half of last year's installations.
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Post by ZenMaster on Apr 2, 2020 7:44:16 GMT -5
New installation are down to 24, less than half of last year's installations. This list was updated this month, assuming taking out the Vail ones. How many of the remaining do you think will keep going forward? two @ A-Basin, Aspen Highlands & Snowmass, Sugarbush, Saddleback.... liftblog.com/2020-new-lifts/Speaking of Saddleback, they are dismantling the current chair now. They posted a cool video on social of pulling down 4 towers at once with a groomer.
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Post by Machski on Apr 2, 2020 8:22:11 GMT -5
New installation are down to 24, less than half of last year's installations. This list was updated this month, assuming taking out the Vail ones. How many of the remaining do you think will keep going forward? two @ A-Basin, Aspen Highlands & Snowmass, Sugarbush, Saddleback.... liftblog.com/2020-new-lifts/I would think surface lifts supported by ski clubs like Sugarbush will continue forward. I don't see why areas like Saddleback of Timberline Mountain WV wouldn't continue forward as well, they really have nothing to loose being closed this season. Magic will get Black Quad done. Sun Valley may do Cold Springs still since that was originally planned to go in for this past season. Yellowstone's lift too, being a private club. The rest that are direct replacements are less sure, given they have standing functional lifts in place currently. Would you want to take the risk to pull them down only to have the virus flare back up mid-late summer and shut down construction leaving nothing? I could maybe see Mammoth doing Broadway Express, the Panorama Gondola and Unbound HSQ would still be there to get folks out of main lodge. Canyon is a much more risky install for them, that would leave Discovery and a FGT out of Canyon Lodge which is heavily used and served by the Village Gondola. Lots for resorts to contemplate beyond just cash flow/cost.
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Post by ZenMaster on Apr 2, 2020 8:26:54 GMT -5
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